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Is Phil Jones the next Michael Dawson?

Discussion in 'Sports Talk' started by ONEDUNME, Nov 15, 2011.

  1. ONEDUNME

    ONEDUNME Administrator

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    I watched the highlights tonight and counted the number of times his name was mentioned in case he'd dine anything decent and I'd missed it. So you know how many tines his name was even mentioned? Once.

    Once! and that was when he was credited with the goal.

    I would have liked to see him moved to the back when Vidic went off. I want to see if he can be a world class defender not a just above average midfielder. I've seen nothing to suggest that he's going to be a great player in that role either. Yes he can look OK in midfield against Wolves but stick half the midfielders in the championship in Uniteds midfield for that game and they would too.

    Too early to say he's a flat track bully but when is he going to play well against a decent team?
  2. Wayne

    Wayne Active Member

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    How can I argue when your research is so thorough. :lol
  3. Gavster

    Gavster Novelty & Proud

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    Based on last night's performance, there's one thing we should all agree on, he was miles better than Micheal Carrick!
  4. ONEDUNME

    ONEDUNME Administrator

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    I'm getting bored of having to explain everything to you Wayne. it's like having a conversation with a small child.

    I watched the game live and then watched the highlights afterwards. The clue is in my post when I said that I wanted to check whether I had missed something good about Jones' performance. I hadn't.

    He put in an average performance (not a bad one admittedly) in a game that the ITV commentary would have us believe United dominated.

    He was innefective in his midfield role but SAF insisted on keeping him there and bringing on a player to replace Vidic who isn't even good enough to be at the club. If this is what is happening in December how do u expect to have a squad good enough to be winning the league?
  5. Wayne

    Wayne Active Member

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    :lol So stop replying then! Just because it's YOUR thread and I'm supposed to be honoured to be part of it doesn't mean you have to reply if I bore you so much does it?

    Anyway, why are you suddenly completely devoid of a sense of humour? Tried to indicate I was joking with :lol but obviously that didn't work. You're a right touchy bugger at the moment (more than normal I should say) - everything ok (seriously)?

    And I can't be arsed talking football with you anymore as we'll never agree and obviously the view from your armchair gives you a higher level of knowledge than us normal folk. :wink
  6. Yorkieacer

    Yorkieacer BEST GAMBLER IN WORLD

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    I will throw it out there now like i did last season i guarantee we will win the league this season by at least 3 points
  7. Gavster

    Gavster Novelty & Proud

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    With who putting the ball in the net? Own goals was nearly top scorer for Utd last season right? Is that part of your master plan?
  8. Wayne

    Wayne Active Member

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    Oh for fucks sake. :banghead
  9. slick

    slick Administrator

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    Stick to betting Yorkie:unsure
  10. Punter

    Punter Moderator

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    8,802
    ....you're away with the fairies now Yorkie
  11. Punter

    Punter Moderator

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    8,802
    Man utd finishing position - odds from Stan James
    1st - 9/4
    2nd 4/5
    Exactly 3rd 7/2
    4th or worse 14/1
  12. Yorkieacer

    Yorkieacer BEST GAMBLER IN WORLD

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    Right last season i got slated when i said we would win the league and get to the champions league final and people admitted they were wrong in the end and you guys will this time when i guarantee something like this it happens! Come back end of season and you will see me being a smug cunt again ill give People odds on it!
  13. Wayne

    Wayne Active Member

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    Go on, I'll bite! :lol What odds then Yorkie?

    I'm actually wondering how much impact Cleverley's injury has had on us. We played some of the best football I've ever seen us play pre-season and in the first three games of this season until Davies scythed him down at Bolton. He was linking play up, bossing the midfield and pretty much driving the team forward. Since then our form has gone from bad to worse and we've become workmanlike struggling through games. Coincidence?

    Or did the 6-1 against Citeh do more mental damage than Fergie's letting on? Fergie definitely changed the way we play after that and tightened up the defence. What I don't get is we've jointly conceded the least number of goals in the League (amazing stat considering 6 went in against Citeh), yet leaked really poor goals in the Champs League. Shipping 8 goals in 4 games against Benfica and Basle, who are no better than mid-table Premier League teams (in my opinion), is shocking.

    We're a team in transition but I think Fergie's got more problems to solve now than he ever has. And with an injury crisis that's getting worse by the week, we're gonna have to wait for those answers. We've got a really tough few months ahead of us and I think the best we can hope for is that we can hang onto Citeh's coat-tails until we can get a few back and then see what happens. Citeh aren't Man City anymore (a fact unsurprisingly overlooked by the Bitters who have become the very same thing they slagged United, Blackburn and Chelsea off for in the past) and I can't see them self-destructing like they used to.

    So with all that in mind, I haven't the faintest idea where your confidence comes from.
    Or is this another 'Janet Devlin' moment? :lol
  14. winrew

    winrew GILF

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    Vidic out for the rest of the season ..
  15. keemanan

    keemanan Manchester City Premier League Winners 2011/12

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    United have spent -3m net since Ronaldo left, less than Hull City. Oh and Wayne you would like to think us citeh fans have changed but we haven't , we will never turn into the complete wankers you lot became after years of winning trophys. You can not accept defeat in any way, it's like you DEMAND sucess, idiots.
    Anyroad Jones isn't a bad player BUT when folks compared him to Dunc Edwards, even though you would need to be in your 70's to fairly compare the two, I knew he's in trouble. I prefer Smalling as a defender but I actually rate Dawson too now , I think he has learnt his trade under Twitcher
  16. slick

    slick Administrator

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    I've always thought Dawson was a half decent defender, his problem is lapses in concentration leading to some critical mistakes on a regular basis, I don't know if Harry's worked his magic on him Keem or he's just gradually getting better through experience, personall I think it's more of the latter.

    City's 6-1 win has seriously demoralised United which was to be expected but I didn't think it would last this long, after that defeat they have tried to shore up things and get back on track which I have no doubt they will, Uniteds biggest problem at the moment is having a shakey defence that look nervous as fcuk when any team comes at them, I'd like to say City were the cause of that but United were living a charmed life defensively way before that defeat, City just exploited it with the quality we have up front.

    Injuries haven't helped United in that department either as every week United seem to have a different back four not through choice and it would take a blind man not to see Ferdinhand is rapidly on the decline but Fergie thinks he has to stick with him for his experience at this level, and to be fair so would any decent manager as it would be suicide not to as he would get crucified if things went tit's up had he not.
    Fergies no mug though and I'll be very suprised if he does not buy a decent CB come January, more so now Vidic is out for the rest of the season, If that happens then I would expect Ferdinhand to take a back seat and Jones to take his place with Smalling and Ferdinhand as cover.

    I'm picking Jones over Smalling because like I said earlier in this thread, Jones is the nearest I've seen to a young Ferdinhand and with Uniteds Injuries Smalling can fill in at right back.
    Jones first and foremost needs to learn his trade at the position he is best at which is CB and the reason he was bought, I know through circumstance he's been asked to play in midfield but you can see in that position both for England and United he doesn't know when to hold em or when to fold em, I say let the lad learn his trade at CB first and with the problems United currently have in that position it would be daft no to at the moment.

    Had United been at full strength NOW I would say they were in with a chance of the Premiership title but looking at their treatment table and the amount of time some of their key players will be out for, It would take a super human effort to win it considering the strength of Citys squad with no serious Injuries at the moment concerning any of Mancinis first eleven.

    As for Cleverley, who knows? reading and listening to a lot of united fans they seem to be expecting a lot for a young lad who has only played a handful of games for United, hope and expectation is a great thing but it's a huge ask and a lot of pressure on a young mans shoulders if he's reading the same things as me and expected to turn Uniteds season around.
    Best to give the lad some slack otherwise he'll be out with another Injury no sooner as he comes back, he looks a decent player but it's far to early to see just what level he is at.
  17. ONEDUNME

    ONEDUNME Administrator

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    Genius, fucking genius.

    If he'd quietly worked his way up to the position of "half decent" i wouldn't have a problem at all.

    I actually agree that Dawson is a "half decent" defender. What I object to is the cunt was hailed as the next England captain and nailed on central defender when he was about 19 or 20 or something. He even trained with the England team and his future was assured. The only problem was, he was an overated dipshit with the sense of positioning of the Belgrano and the heading ability of John fucking Merrick.

    I had the nerve to point out the fact that he was an overated twat. Sue me. It turns out that, ten years or so later, I was fucking right.

    I see the same thing happening with Jones. Don't get me wrong, I'd love him to turn out to be the best central defender in the world in 8 years time. Trouble is, I have seen fuck all to suggest that he can be. He can't fuking tackle for a start. Why am I the only one who can see this?

    Fergie should play him in central defence in the absence of Vidic and let him grow into the part and make the spot his own and then transfer that to the national team and stop fucking about.
  18. slick

    slick Administrator

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    15,579
    I say what I see ODM, if anybody needs to 'read' how good a player is then they know fcuk all about football.

    When i first saw Dawson I remember referring to him as 'Les Dawson' same way I referred to Carson as 'Frank Carson' as their displays were fcuking pathetic when i saw them.
    But Dawson has the ability to put in a good display one week then spoil it the next because he is not focused and prone to mistakes, hence i see him as 'half decent'.
    At his age he's not going to improve to a degree where i see him as International class, hence the reason I agree that he should be nowhere near the International team, saying that if Upson could get in under Capello then it's no suprise to see Dawson.
  19. ONEDUNME

    ONEDUNME Administrator

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    I'm agreeing with you. The Spurs fans will tell you that they rate him but if you watch his positioning, it's fucking shite and he has to make last ditch tackles that look impressive but should never have to be made. Likewise, I've never seen a player have a ball bounce over his head because he's just in the wrong place so often.

    His concentration is woeful. They put it down to youth and said he would improve.

    He hasn't.

    Will Jones be different? That's the question that I'm asking. We won't know until Fergie plays him at the back. If he's the future of England's midfield then you may as well not bother watching them for the next 8 years. He has nothing that any other average premiership midfielder has.

    As the Arctic Monkey's would say ....Don't believe the hype
  20. Wayne

    Wayne Active Member

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    571
    That's the Premier League generation for you though Keem. Give it a few years of success (which I'm certain you're going to have) and your lot will be doing the very same thing. Attracting supporters from all corners of the country who know nothing different but to expect success. Liverpool went through it. We've been through it. Chelsea and Arsenal went through it (to a lesser degree).

    You've spent years ramming 'we're the locals club, we're a football club not a PLC, etc, etc' down our throat in response to United spending millions every year and winning trophies every year. More than understandable as you'd nothing else to shout about. But suddenly an Arab (not from Manchester) appears who pumps a ridiculous amount of money into your club and begins to turn your club into the same commerical whore United are and you think your club won't change? Do me a favour. It already has. From a success point of view, a great move. From the 'romantic football bubble' point of view that you lot live in, gone.

    I wouldn't expect you to think Citeh fans have changed because what your club has become/is becoming is exactly the thing you've criticised for years. I've watched it with United from the days when we were shit to now. It would be naive to think the same won't happen/is happening to your lot too. Stop kidding yourself mate.

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